Allsup, and Filing Concurrent Social Security Disability and Long-Term Disability Claims

Welcome to Season 5, Episode 15 of Winning Isn't Easy. In this episode, we'll dive into the complicated topic of "Allsup, and Filing Concurrent Social Security Disability and Long-Term Disability Claims."

Join attorney Nancy L. Cavey, a leading expert in disability claims, for an eye-opening discussion on the intersection of ERISA Disability insurance and Social Security Disability benefits. If your Long-Term Disability carrier has suggested using a third-party service like Allsup to handle your SSDI application, you’re not alone - but is that really in your best interest? In today’s episode, we’re pulling back the curtain on what Allsup promises versus what you may actually experience. From the fine print in your ERISA policy to the strategic timing of your SSDI application, we’ll explore why many claimants are required to apply for Social Security Disability - often before their Long-Term Disability claim is even approved. Whether you're just starting the claims process or re-evaluating your options, this episode is packed with essential guidance to help you make informed decisions, avoid common pitfalls, and protect your financial future. So, let’s get into it.

In this episode, we'll cover the following topics:

One - Did Your ERISA Disability Carrier Suggest That You Use Allsup to File a Claim for Social Security Disability Insurance? Why the Four Claims That Allsup Makes About Why You Should Use Them to Handle Your Social Security Disability Don’t Make Sense

Two - Is Allsup Really Interested in Helping Me or the Disability Insurance Carrier When the Carrier Recommends I Use Allsup to Apply for Social Security Disability Benefits?

Whether you're a claimant, or simply seeking valuable insights into the disability claims landscape, this episode provides essential guidance to help you succeed in your journey. Don't miss it.


Listen to Our Sister Podcast:

We have a sister podcast - Winning Isn't Easy: Navigating Your Social Security Disability Claim. Give it a listen: https://wiessdpodcast.buzzsprout.com/


Resources Mentioned in This Episode:

LINK TO ROBBED OF YOUR PEACE OF MIND: https://mailchi.mp/caveylaw/ltd-robbed-of-your-piece-of-mind

LINK TO THE DISABILITY INSURANCE CLAIM SURVIVAL GUIDE FOR PROFESSIONALS: https://mailchi.mp/caveylaw/professionals-guide-to-ltd-benefits

FREE CONSULT LINK: https://caveylaw.com/contact-us/


Need Help Today?:

Need help with your Long-Term Disability or ERISA claim? Have questions? Please feel welcome to reach out to use for a FREE consultation. Just mention you listened to our podcast.

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Please remember that the content shared is for informational purposes only, and should not replace personalized legal advice or guidance from qualified professionals. 

Transcript

Nancy Cavey [00:00:00]:
 Foreign hey, I'm Nancy Cavey, national ERISA and individual disability attorney. Welcome to Winning Isn't Easy. Before we get started, I've got to give you a legal disclaimer. This podcast is not legal advice. The Florida Bar association says I have to say it. So now I've done that. Nothing will ever prevent me from giving you an easy to understand overview of the disability insurance world, the games that carriers play, and what you need to know to get the disability benefits you deserve. Now in today's episode, we're going to be diving into the complexities of the ERISA disability insurance and Social Security disability claim world.
 
 Nancy Cavey [00:00:49]:
 If your ERISA disability carrier has recommended that you use a service like Olsip or some other service to file your Social Security disability claim, you may have some questions about whether that's the best choice for you. In this episode, I'm going to break down what we believe the truth to be behind the claims that Allsup makes about helping you with your Social Security disability application and why those claims may not make sense for you. We're also going to discuss how many ERISA disability policies require you to apply for Social Security benefits and why, what the impact is going to be because it can be significant. So let's get into this. We're going to talk about number one, did your ERISA disability carrier suggest that you use Allsup to file a claim for Social Security disability benefits? And what are the four claims that Allsup makes about why you should be using them to handle your Social Security claim? Don't make sense. And number two, if is also and these types of services really interested in helping you or the disability insurance carrier to when they recommend that you use them to apply for your Social Security disability benefits. So come back with a pad and a pen or your phone so you can be taking notes because this is some really great information. We get calls about this in our law firm every day.
 
 Nancy Cavey [00:02:10]:
 Got it. Let's take a quick break.
 
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 Nancy Cavey [00:02:47]:
 Welcome back to Winning Isn't Easy. Did you ERISA disability carrier plan suggest that you use Allsup or a similar service to file a claim for your Social Security disability benefits? Why? The four claims that Allsup makes about why you should use them don't make sense in our view. Now let's set the stage here. Most ERISA disability insurance policies or plans require that you apply for your Social Security disability benefits. Why? Well, the plan or the policy consider Social Security disability benefits to be other income that can be deducted dollar for dollar from the gross amount of your long term disability benefits. Additionally, any benefits that your minor dependents get can also be used to reduce dollar for dollar your Social Security benefits. So in the game that's being played here is they want to reduce the amount of your disability benefits based on the receipt of Social Security disability benefits or those of your dependents. Now by the way, there are other offsets in these policies or plans that let them reduce benefits for the receipt of things like workers comp or personal injury settlement PIP benefits.
 
 Nancy Cavey [00:03:59]:
 But today we're just going to talk about Social Security disability benefits. Now it is not uncommon for the ERISA disability carrier plan to recommend a vendor such as also to assist you in applying for your Social Security disability benefits. We often get a call saying what's this about? And is this a good idea? Let's start out by looking at what Allsup has to say about themselves. Now if you go to their website you're going to see some interesting claims. Number one, they're the only nationwide representative that understands the financial issues you are facing. Really? Number two, they provide expert Social Security disability help. Really? Number three, they can help you get your benefits sooner. Really? And number four, they claim to have a 97% Social Security Disability success rate and you have a 50% higher likelihood of receiving your benefits.
 
 Nancy Cavey [00:04:56]:
 Really? Okay, so let's take these on. Number one, they say they're the only nationwide representative that understand the financial issues you are facing. Now look, I'm going to call them. Every Social Security disability lawyer or long term disability lawyer understands firsthand the financial difficulties caused by disability. It's one of the first things we discuss in a consultation with our clients so that we can set our clients expectations properly about the Social Security disability claims process, how much they're going to get in benefits and how long it's going to take, what resources are available in the community to provide assistance and how this interacts with their long term disability benefits. There is not a thing, there's nothing that's unique about Allsup's claim. But those who have lived through it know it better than Allsup. And guess what? My family has lived through this.
 
 Nancy Cavey [00:05:47]:
 My dad became disabled when I was growing up and he filed a Social Security disability claim and his long term Disability claim. So I promise you that we lawyers understand what you're going through. Now number two, they claim to provide expert Social Security disability help. What I have seen in my experience is it also provides you with a representative who's not necessarily an attorney and not necessarily an expert. And I've had to clean up messes that also have made on Social Security disability cases. I can personally attest, based on my experience that expert is not a word that I would use to describe the impact that mistakes can have on a Social Security disability claim and ultimately a long term disability claim. Now, did you catch the term representative in their claim? That's code language that the person who's representing you is not an attorney. Now they have to be accredited as a representative.
 
 Nancy Cavey [00:06:45]:
 But how truthful is that claim of expertise in Allsup's website? Number three, they can get your benefits sooner. The reality is that no one can get your benefits sooner. Each case is different and unique and has to be developed differently. Even in cases that qualify for a compassionate allowance or a 100% disabled veteran fast track, the cases are different. It's really all about the case development which involves getting your medical records, developing the history of your symptoms and functionality, obtaining appropriate residual functional capacity forms for from your doctor to attest to your restrictions and limitations. And I have found not only is it case development which can help get an earlier decision in quotes once it's in front of the claims examiner. I wouldn't say earlier. I think I maybe say faster.
 
 Nancy Cavey [00:07:42]:
 But no one is necessarily going to speed up the process because the process is what the process is. But I also think that it's very important that you be prepared for your hearing by being represented by a Social Security ERISA disability attorney who shares a mock Social Security disability hearing video with a client before the hearing who conducts a or has basically done an hour long video on the preparation for a hearing and then has a practice session with a client weeks before the hearing. And that's in contrast to what I have always seen is where at least when we used to do live Social Security hearings, they would actually meet their representative for the first time at the hearing. That's not right now of course, I don't know if that if the first time that they are the Allsup representative is meeting with the client is at the before the phone hearing. But I would hope not. So again, there is no doubt that having legal representation can shorten the processing time once the claim has been sent to a claims examiner. And why? Because in our particular case we develop and provide all the medical evidence, including residual functional capacity forms, so that when the claims examiner finally gets assigned to the claim, they have what they need on a silver platter, so that the reason why you meet the five step sequential evaluation test should be apparent from that documentation. Now, that doesn't necessarily guarantee that the claims examiner is going to agree that you're entitled to the benefits, but many times what will happen is the claims examiner will pick it up for the first time and then has to go order medical records, which takes time.
 
 Nancy Cavey [00:09:28]:
 And they don't necessarily get all the medical records, which results in a denial. We believe that preparation and providing this information to the Social Security Administration, including the residual functional capacity forms, can make all the difference. So the other claim they have is that they have a 97% success rate and that you have a 50% higher likelihood of receiving benefits. Now, that math doesn't even make sense. Success rate is a product of case selection, case development, what's in your medical records, the consistency of your report of your activities, the forms that you fill out, and if appropriate, the testimony in front of a judge. The success rate for getting Social Security benefits is higher when represented by an attorney. Statistics show that it can be up to three times higher compared to those who are representing themselves. And of course, a firm's approval rate can vary depending on the specific facts of the case, the medical complexity, and even the judge.
 
 Nancy Cavey [00:10:31]:
 Now, also's claim that you have an over 50% higher likelihood of receiving benefits by using them is less than the 66% rate quoted by the government. So is it a good idea to use Allsup when the claims they make about their company don't add up? Is it a good idea to believe that they have your best interests at heart? Is it a good idea to believe that they are working for you and not the disability carrier or plan? We're going to take that up in our next segment, but let's take a break.
 
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 Nancy Cavey [00:11:51]:
 Welcome back to Winning Isn't Easy. Is Allsup really interested in helping you or the disability carrier plan when they recommend that you use OSUP to get your Social Security benefits. Now, most ERISA disability carriers or plans require that you apply for Social Security disability benefits. Why? The policy of the plan considers Social Security disability benefits and that of your minor children to be other income that's going to be deducted dollar for dollar from the gross amount of your long term benefits. In other words, it's a way for the carrier of the plan to legally reduce how much you get paid in your benefits. So let me take you through some math. If your long term disability policy pays you $5,000 per month and your Social Security disability benefits are $2,000 per month, the disability carrier only has to pay you $3,000 per month. Now of course you'll still get your Social Security benefits and that exercise, that deduction is going to apply even if you don't apply for Social Security disability benefits.
 
 Nancy Cavey [00:12:52]:
 Because many times people will say, well, I'm not going to apply for those benefits. To which I say, well, too bad, so sad. Because the policy or the plan lets them take the offset regardless of whether you've applied or not. So how does this go? Well, you apply for your long term disability benefits, the carrier or plan starts paying you and then they say, look, you should sign up with Allsupport, a similar company, and it's at no financial cost to you because they'll help you apply for your Social Security disability benefits. Now, I am always asked, are they really interested in helping me or are they helping the disability carrier? Well, if you have to ask that question, you already know what the answer is. And the short answer is they're interested in helping the disability carrier and not you. So what are the problems potentially with using Allsup and other providers that are recommended by disability carriers or plans? Number one, they have a conflict of interest. Number two, the sharing of medical information and confidences and other relevant information can potentially destroy your ERISA disability claim.
 
 Nancy Cavey [00:14:03]:
 So let's talk about these in greater detail. Now let's talk about conflict of interest. They have no ethical obligation to put your interests first because they want to help long term disability insurance companies like Unum, Cigna, MetLife, Mutual of Omaha, NY Life and Standard Reliance, who send them lots of cases. And they get paid regardless, I think, of whether they win or not. So as a financial incentive to you, they claim that the disability carrier will pay the attorney's fee for securing the benefits. And the reality is that most disability carriers are going to deduct from the offset calculations the attorney fee that you pay to your private attorney. So what do I mean by that? Many times what I find is that they'll dangle this financial incentive in front of people. They'll say, look, we're going to pay for the attorney, and you don't have to worry about that.
 
 Nancy Cavey [00:15:04]:
 And we're not going to deduct what we pay from the offset amount. In my experience, what will happen is they don't deduct it anyway. So. So if I get the Social Security disability benefits and I get paid a fee, I've always found that the carrier plan doesn't consider the amount of the fee. In other words, they don't penalize you for it in determining the offset. So whatever the back benefits are minus the attorney's fee, that net is the number that they are using to calculate the offset. So that claim that they are giving you something for nothing or that they're going to pay the fee and it won't impact you, I think is a bogus fee. I think that misrepresentation alone is unethical and it demonstrates a clear conflict of interest.
 
 Nancy Cavey [00:15:50]:
 Now, when you sign up with one of these services, they're going to ask you to sign a number of releases that allows them to secure your medical records. And you have to agree that any back benefits they secure will be electronically sucked out of your bank account and sent to the disability carrier. Now, while the carrier has the right to an offset of back benefits, I find there's often a disagreement as of the period of the offset and the amount of the offset. So giving the disability, excuse me, carrier, the back pay that you might be due right off the bat makes it difficult for you to get your money back if they're wrong, and they are often wrong. Let's talk about sharing of medical information and confidences and other relevant information. What information gets shared, I don't think is confidential. I think it's often shared with a disability carrier plan. They may say they walled it off.
 
 Nancy Cavey [00:16:43]:
 I don't really think that's true, and I think that's problematic for a number of reasons. Many disability policies or plans have limitations on the amount of benefits that are going to be paid or the time. Rather that the benefits are going to be paid for a mental nervous condition or subjective conditions. And these clauses are called mental nervous or subjective medical condition clauses. So let's say your policy has a mental nervous policy condition clause that says if your disability is caused or contributed ever so slightly, benefits are limited to two years. So you've had a back injury. That's the basis of your disability claim. But you're depressed as you should be depressed.
 
 Nancy Cavey [00:17:28]:
 What will happen, in my experience, is that these companies will develop the depression as the basis of the claim, not necessarily the back, or they will really try to hammer potentially the combination so that there is this contribution issue. What we try to do is to be very selective about what medical condition we're claiming is the basis of the disability claim and the Social Security disability claims. And we want to make sure if we've got one of these Monty Python type wafer thin contribution clauses, mental nervous clauses, that we are not developing the mental nervous condition as the cause of the disability. It's there, but it's not the cause. That's not necessarily true with how the file is developed if you are using a service recommended by the insurance company. Now, the other thing you need to understand is that there is a subjective medical condition limitation in some policies. And people who have problems with back spasms, migraines, pain, fatigue, those conditions, again, can be limited to just two years of benefits. Again, we've got to be very selective about what medical conditions we're developing for both the Social Security and the ERISA disability claim and making sure that any disability is not caused by these subjective medical conditions.
 
 Nancy Cavey [00:18:57]:
 It's a factor, but it is not the cause of disability. And so we try to go to great lengths to make that distinction in the medical records. And we do that in part by explaining to our clients how to tell the story of their symptoms and functionality in a way that the doctor can legitimately and honestly conclude that it is not the cause of the disability. Now, do you think that companies like Allsup and other services are going to take the time to dissect the medical look at the policy, figure out what condition should be the basis of the Social Security claim, how to limit the impact of the disabling medical condition in conjunction with the clauses in the policy so that at the end of the two years, the carrier can't say, hey, we, wait a second. Yeah, we know you have back pain, but your disability has been contributed to as a result of your depression or by the way, fatigue is the cause of your disability and fatigue is a condition that's limited to just two years under your ERISA disability policy or plans. So it's an important distinction, isn't it? So I'm often asked, should I use a company like Allsup or any other company recommended by the disability carrier or plant? I think the answer is, hell no. They cannot really legally prevent you from contracting with an attorney of your choice to represent you. In your Social Security disability claim.
 
 Nancy Cavey [00:20:21]:
 In fact, I've never seen a disability carrier plan say if you don't use Allsup or fill in the blank, we're going to deny your benefits. I think it's wiser to have an attorney who has your best interests at heart, knows how to develop the appropriate medical conditions to win both of your claims, and will work closely with you with your long term disability attorney if you are not represented by an attorney such as myself who do both long term disability and Social Security benefits. So got it. I think that your head should be spinning, but at the end of the day the answer is no, you should not be using these types of services. Yes, you should be finding your own ERISA disability and Social Security attorney. Hopefully they're the same. If not, make sure they are both talking with each other and both understand what needs to be proven in each case. And we'll coordinate the development of the medical proof so that you get both your Social Security disability benefits and your ERISA disability benefits.
 
 Nancy Cavey [00:21:24]:
 Thanks for tuning in to this week's episode of Winning Isn't Easy. Hopefully you now have a clearer picture of why it might not be in your best interest to use Allsup or any other service to assist you with your claim. Remember, when it comes to both your Social Security disability and your ERISA benefits, you deserve an advocate who has your best interests in heart. You need to understand that they have to be fully dedicated to your case and will guide you through the process from the very beginning. If you found this episode helpful, please take a moment to like our page, leave a review, and share it with your family or friends and subscribe to this podcast. We would also love to hear from you. At the beginning of each episode description, you'll find a link where you can send us your questions or comments. We might even feature you in a future episode.
 
 Nancy Cavey [00:22:10]:
 So thanks and join us next week for another insightful episode of Winning Isn't Easy.